The immediate effect of the decision was a partial victory for 72-year-old Juozas Kungys, a retired dental technician from Clifton.

"In this heat," said Mr. Straker, a retired dental technician from Barbados, "you have to get the kite up high or it won't fly."

Vidal Pereyra, 60, a retired technician, said that he saw the submarine in the 1980's.

Charles Jansen, a 72-year-old retired electronic technician from Wichita, Kan., said Mrs. Clinton should not be helping make appointments since she was not elected.

"I don't know how many lawyers we have in town, but she was the only one who offered to help," said Mr. Joy, a retired electronic technician.

Robert R. Nesselrotte, a 63-year-old retired technician from Columbus, Ga., said it took him about three minutes to find his rubberized chemical-protective suit and pull it on.

Jim Crowe, 66, a retired electronic technician, said he had supported Mr. Florio for governor, but now blamed him for reduced retirement savings.

Yesterday, Mr. Bramble, a retired medical technician and minister, returned to his old haunt.

"We like being outdoors and doing the heavy-duty stuff," said the crew chief, John Coughlin, a 77-year-old retired technician from Bellmore and a 10-year volunteer.

"It didn't collapse - it blew away," said Clifford L. Dodson, 73, her father, a retired technician with the Federal Aviation Administration.